Will the PS3 be like Segas Dreamcast

Want to just shoot the breeze? Forum 42 is the place!

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bicostp
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Post by bicostp »

I seriously doubt the PS3 will be Sony's achille's heel in the videogame market, the only reason why people aren't clamoring to it yet is because (from what I know of anyways) there's no games announced to ship when the console does. If they announced Gran Turismo 5 and put up screenshots, I bet more people will think about it.

The 360 obviously isn't going to fail out of the starting gate. Microsoft has money coming out their arses so they can always pump more moola into the console. See that's one of the reasons I hate Microsoft; they get into a field and take away market share from other companies. (Nintendo's case in 1985 was different, back then there barely were any game companies! :P) In the computer world, they introduce a new format, let's just say ".dyg" ("Damn you Gates!" :P). Then only, and ONLY Microsoft products can read that standard. The newest version of Office comes with it standard, and it monopolizes the computer industry with it. Soon all must use some form of M$ product to read it, regardless of OS. (Oh and Linux users? M$ jsut says "f*** them. They should run Windows" :roll: :evil:)

And they could be more imaginative with their names. I mean "Xbox" was kinda cool, but why"360"? Why "Internet Explorer"? Why "Word"? Why not "Wordmill" or something more colorful? Their names are just so utilitarian. I swear if M$ made toilet paper it would be called "Microsoft excrement Wiper" :lol: :roll:

As I've said in the past, there are only 3 things keeping Nintendo in the hardware horse race: A large variety of kid's games, parental recognition, and proprietary games.

<u>Kid's Games</u>
A lot of Nintendo's games of late, such as the Mario Party series, seem kind of "kiddie" to me. I mean big, colorful graphics in bright pastels? A littl emore realism wouldn't hurt them much... (I wonder if anyone made one of those texture patches to make Mario 64 look more realistic...) Just my opinion, no offense to anyone. (actually Goldeneye for N64 was quite good)

<u>Parental Recognition</u>
Since Nintendo has been in the console market in the USA for 20 years, parents who grew up with the NES will be buying the Revolution for their kids. For example, a parent would think "I don't want to buy a 360, because thta game for it ''Bloodthirsty Hell Zombies 2: Braaaaiiins'' looks way too scary for my kids. I'll buy the Revolution because it has Mario, the Legend of Zelda, and all those other names I trust... Donkey Kong..." HOWEVER, BHZ2:B is out for <i>all three consoles</i>! I have actually SEEN obvious soccer moms in Best Buy talking to themselves almost exactly like my example.
(side note: I saw one woman who refused to buy "Luigi's Mansion" for her 6 year old son because it was "too scary". :roll: Yeah, so you better keep him away from Casper, Slimer, and Boo Berry too, lady. :roll:)

<u>Proprietary Software</u>
Mario, Link, DK, all those other characters are out SOLELY on Nintendo hardware. This goes back to what I said about Microsoft's "standards" a while back, as Nintendo is doing basically the same thing. They make games JUST for THEIR hardware, so if you buy a PS3 and suddenly decide to play Mario, you're copulated. You have to buy a Game Boy, a DS, or a 'cube or a Revolution. If Nintendo dropped their "closed standards" methodology and developed their games for the 360 and PS3, they would probably lose most of their hardware market. (some people may buy Nintendo hardware because it's cheaper, but for a bit more you can get a unit with more features.

Here's my 2 cents. (plus a few extras I found in between the couch cushions) :lol:
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Post by SpongeBuell »

bicostp wrote:Luigi's Mansion
I know this is going a bit off topic, but I think it's funny enough to be worth it.

Back when the gamecube was pretty new, and Luigi's mansion was out, I was playing it at ToysRUs, since it was on display. One thing that most people probably don't notice is that when Luigi moves, so does his nose. However, there was a guy behind me, with whom I am assuming is his wife and (teenagerish) daughter. He then commented, "Boy, look at his nose bounce. Think if he had breasts." :lol: (true story :) )
Life of Brian wrote:
RYW wrote:RYW:

Rare
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I'll be honest with you - I would have never guessed that.
Conn
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Post by Conn »

Bic is entirely right.
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Post by Reaperman@home »

(Oh and Linux users? M$ jsut says "f*** them. They should run Windows" )
I don't think microsoft really cares about such a small percentage of PC users, a good number of which would probably just steal copies of windows software anyway. M$ cares about the masses.

The business market is a little different, but linux isn't exactly a lot cheaper for *most* networks when you factor in the added IT support needed. It's not exactly an out of the box solution, but it is attractive to larger entities.

also don't forget nintendo is being kept afloat by it's large share of the handheld market--not nearly a monopoly anymore, but still the larger share. Such a wide variety of games, including a fair number of traditionally Sony-associated names like Spyro and Crash, but I imagine GBA/DS won't be seeing any more of those two.
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Post by teraflop122 »

See that's one of the reasons I hate Microsoft; they get into a field and take away market share from other companies.
[damsel in distress] OH, God forbid Microsoft tries to do what ALL companies are DESIGNED to do! How dare those evil people strive for the PRIMARY GOAL OF ALL COMPANIES! Lets all hate those people, just because they made GOOD decisions and became rich, while we haven't! [damsel in distress/]

Sigh. I would love to be Gates right now. If I were in his position, I would ignore Linux users just as thoroughly, because those are the people who tend to illegally download the software which teams of programmers labored over glaring computer monitors for years at a time to produce.

Hmm. I do wonder what would happen if Nintendo focused all of its resources solely on the portable market. We'd probably see some pretty nifty handhelds and games, that much is for sure.
bicostp
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Post by bicostp »

No, I didn't just mean staking a claim in the market, I meant how the MONOPOLIZE everything! (at least in the PC word)

Think about it:

Most popular OS- Microsoft Windows
Most popular productivity suite? Microsoft Office
Most popular browser? Microsoft Internet Explorer

And all the rest... Microsoft .asp server, Microsoft-bastardized HTML, MSN, .wmv, .wma, Outlook...

All of their products don't gain any signifigfant features very often; they lump them all into new versions. And in order to use the new documents, you need the new program. In order to use the new program, you need to run the latest version of Windows. (I think Office 2003 has problems with Windows 2000, which is IMO batter than XP)

For example, Office 12 will use a new format for the .doc "standard". (I say ''"standard"'' because it's not very "standard". I mean they still haven't figured out how to have 100% full compatibility with Office in AbiWord!) In order to use the new format, you'll have to either upgrade or use a roundabout way of using Word, downloading the viewer and copy/pasting the text into Word XP. It's ridiculous.

While open source software developers are always adding features, and people are always developing new plug-ins. There are web pages with over 100 things listed that Firefox can do that IE cannot. :roll:

I mean it's not that Microsoft is completely evil, it's just that they abuse their monopoly power. I'm actually using a PC with 0 lines of MS code on it for most of my school work, and I've used the Windows 98 machines at school as bodies for my DSL live CD. (it's just faster, and the 98 installs at school are F.U.B.A.R. :lol:) It would be easier and a lot more stable if MS would accept more open standards. (I use OpenOffice and AbiWord a lot, mainly because I'm cheap and my computers are too old to run the latest software. One's a P2 300, the other's a P3 500. I've got a P3 800 coming, I'll either put 2000 or Knoppix on it)

I'm sort of halfway between an open-software nutcase and a Microsoft loyalist; MS isn't evil, they just abuse their position as.. oh.. roughly 86% (?) of the computer market. And I'm a cheaparse, so I can't run out and buy the latest and "greatest"* version of MS everything. :lol:

* I say this lightly because I believe Word hit its sweet spot back in version 6. (maybe XP, if you don't install the office <u>ass</u>istant and all that extraneous crapola). Windows 2000 was great. XP is bloated, and Vista is just freakin HUGE. Most of my computers are older (5-6 years) so they obviously can't support all this stuff.
Last edited by bicostp on Thu Oct 13, 2005 6:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
teraflop122
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Post by teraflop122 »

That is one portion of US law I tend to dislike. Monopolies are simply the logical conclusions of the perfect business, and suddenly the government has declared that to be successful is to be a criminal :evil:

Microsoft software is primarily made to earn money for Microsoft. The software only needs to be stable enough for the user to remain happy, and most users are just as likely to blame the computer hardware as the software :P

I'm sure your opinion would change if YOU owned a super-mega-ultra-hyper-uber-corporation ~_~
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Post by soundwave »

Its one thing to own a uber-monopoly-company, its another to own an uber-monopoly-company that had been, is, and will be making crap.
Last edited by soundwave on Thu Oct 13, 2005 7:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
bicostp
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Post by bicostp »

Well what would you rather have?

Windows XP pro ($100)
Office 2003 (about $120)
Photoshop ($700)

Or

Knoppix ($0)
GiMP (0)
OpenOffice.org ($0)

?

I really don't care about the manager's point of view. Naturally the manager of a huge conglomorate would want all the money in the world! All I'm saying is that Windows and Mac OS X are the only systems the general public is exposed to, so they think it's the only choice. And then when it breaks they pay through their teeth to get the Geek Squad to fix it, and then they go and fill up their Hummer with premium gasoline and have to resort to their fifth Diner's Club card to pay for it.

I'm looking at this at the cheapassed consumer's point of view. I don't particularly want to spend tons of cash on stuff that will be outdated when the next version comes out. I can justify spending $800 on a decent computer, but a computer can be upgraded. When your old software gets outdated, you're screwed, and the CD gets thrown out or sold for $5 at a yard sale. But with free software, especially ones with a fairly large following like OpenOffice or Firefox, all you do is download the latest version for free.

Look at it this way: I spent a whole $10 on the computer I'm using right now:

mobo, PSU and case (free from school because that's all there was to it)
2x CD burners (1 from one fried school PC, 1 from corporate throwaway)
40 gig HD (from fried PC, my school isn't the most "tech aware" :lol: Had 2000 pre-installed)
ATAPI Iomega ZIP 100 drive (from school, they took it out because peoiple kept putting floppies in it :roll:)
Floppy drive (free from local parts shop)
Netgear GA302T gigabit ethernet card ($10 at MIT tech sale)
Dell QuietKey keyboard (free, dumpster behind my dad's place of work. They throw out lots of great stuff, from screens to mice to hard drives)

So how much do you expect me to dump into it on software? ;) :P

The only Monopoly I like was a blue light special at Kmart. :lol:

Nothing personal, just opposing points of view. :) right? *wink*
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Post by sam fisher »

benheckc wrote:Bullocks, as someone here said the X360 is most likely to be the "next Dreamcast" Rabid support, big opening sales, then KA-BLOOEY.

Also like the Dreamcast it's a replacement system only 4 years after the last. Does this install confidence?

As for the PS3 being too expensive to develop for they said the EXACT SAME THING about the PS2 in 1999-2000. I believe something like:

"with the amount of hardware and what you can do it'll cost something like $10 million to make a PS2 game, so only a few companies (I think they inferred Square, Sony, etc) will even be able to afford to make games for it"

Right. That explains the ZILLION PS2 titles and vast amounts of cheap shovelware.

Who cares if Carmack likes the 360? I bet you my left arm Doom 3 on the Xbox didn't sell near what Halo 2, any Final Fantasy, GTA or Gran Turismo did.

Do people REALLY want the 360 to beat all? Does Microsoft really need to conquer another market? At this rate in 20 years they'll be only 2 companies left on Earth: Microsoft and Wal-mart.
yay ben knows me as 'someone'! but the 360 will be even with the PS3! its similar to the dreamcast but MS has the funds to stop any failiure :O
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Post by cennar »

kade wrote:but halo is doing better than sonic.
but they bouth suck in there own fan boy overload kind of way, (sonic way more that halo)
I really don't care about the manager's point of view. Naturally the manager of a huge conglomorate would want all the money in the world! All I'm saying is that Windows and Mac OS X are the only systems the general public is exposed to, so they think it's the only choice. And then when it breaks they pay through their teeth to get the Geek Squad to fix it, and then they go and fill up their Hummer with premium gasoline and have to resort to their fifth Diner's Club card to pay for it.
exactly, stupid people rule the world fact one. fact two stupid people group them selfs, fact three it realy doesnt matter let them ruin the world and get huge a fat one day they one beable to move and then we the skinny middle class smart folk can have whats left over, then we can decide what to do with all those hummers and BS they left behind, (by the way hummers and most cars are pointless, nice old cars with caracter and a engine spewing gas every ware are much more fun, personaly i BMX every ware) so yeah we can all female of the dog species and guess what happens but its pritty clear that M-TV has told all the stupid people to buy an x-box and all those stupid people will waste all there cash on it to get a few moments of fun before they get bored and foget they just bought what ever they just bought, it realy doesnt matter its going to happen all you can do is make your own mind thats what you need to do not compaine witch gray box is a gray box just buy one or spend it on some thing else, personaly when the 360 and rev and BS3 come out im going to get stoned off my ass like i do every day and play gta, i dont care what im playing it on i just want to play some grad theft auto...

also the
REv looks the most non evil of them all and i cant wait to make a portable nunchuck.
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teraflop122
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Post by teraflop122 »

When WILL I just shut up!? :lol:


stupid people rule the world fact one.
Incorrect. Smart people exploit stupid people in order to rule the world.
fact two stupid people group them selfs
No comment.

I shall never stop fighting for the morally correct side of things. Never!!! :twisted:
but they bouth suck in there own fan boy overload kind of way, (sonic way more that halo)
I'm inclined to agree with this statement. Sonic was cool at one point, but that was quite a while ago :?
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Post by Reaperman@home »

[complete hijack]
Well what would you rather have?

Windows XP pro ($100)
Office 2003 (about $120)
Photoshop ($700)
it's funny you should ask, since I already have bought those programs :lol: Though my office is a behind, it won't be replaced soon.

you're purchasing a standard--in the case of, say microsoft office, naturally its owner will attenpt to protect their doc format. With the proper microsoft tool, you won't have any compatability issues :wink: the fact that any free software at all supports this is amazing, and you should be happy with it.

the photoshop standard goes far deeper. It is a professional tool required by the industry. Gimp on the other hand is a far less polished clone with a variety of silly user interfaces and partially supported formats. It is not an equal. Since my spouse is in this industry, I own photoshop--it costs a heckuva lot less than one of her camera lenses... What a bargain. at least we can write it off on taxes.

As far as the operating system, it's very stable, easy to use and has a rather long life span compared to, at least the bleeding edge of linux. Almost all hardware and software gets full support. You never need to code a driver or an app, and patches are readily available and effortless to install. I never could get that function running in red hat... It had it, just never worked--not to mention the partial drivers I was running on. (and that was the best out of the box distro I found)

I constantly have the same arguement with a buddy on a linux network and the fact is that you get what you pay for. They pay for theirs in a larger IT staff and they still need parts of their network running microsoft. Myself and two others run a building roughly the same size--and let me say that it's not a rough job, I'm working now... The home user pays for it by messing with his OS until his hardware is working to the majority of its fullest and gives up the ability to run certain programs in an efficient manner. You do pay something for those free programs.

Though I see your point. I haven't the time to mess around with linux anymore. I did when I had more time than money, but the price of a computer has dropped so drastically... I just need tools that work for what I need and I need them to work out of the box. [/complete hijack]
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Post by Reploid Ayla »

kade wrote:yes but the 360 has halo
he right, it does have halo :wink:
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teraflop122
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Post by teraflop122 »

Lets just say that if I had a choice between

illegal Win 2000 copy (free)
illegal MS Office XP (free)

and the equivalent Linux software, I would stick with the windows software. Like Reaperman@home said, in all likelihood, your school and place of employment will use windows machines. The standards are worldwide and garaunteed.

I've got a freind whose father (is crazy) pays 250 a month for a T1 line. I routinely ask him to "acquire" software for my own use. When I build computers to sell, however, I put the real deal in them. You know why? Because NO ONE I have worked with is interested in buying a computer loaded with Linux. Even a computer packed with every amazing Linux program in existence. They have always asked for Windows XP. Funny: that. Kinda says something :lol:
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