Overclocking the NES while maintaining audio quality...

Includes Atari 2600, Nintendo 8-bit, Sega Master System, MSX and more!

Moderator: Moderators

nos_slived
Higher Idiot
Posts: 3476
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2005 6:32 pm
Location: Burnaby, BC, Canada
Contact:

Post by nos_slived »

But the video isn't going faster, just smoother. The game runs at the exact same speed, so you neither increase, nor decrease the speed of audio or video. If you could send only audio to a CPU which wasn't overclocked, the video data wouldn't lag the process, so the audio CPU would run smooth, as well as the overclocked video CPU.
Image
soundwave
Senior Member
Posts: 3653
Joined: Wed Feb 23, 2005 1:51 pm
Location: Connecticut

Post by soundwave »

Aha. I was under the impression that the game speed increased.
gannon
Moderator
Posts: 6974
Joined: Sun Apr 04, 2004 4:48 pm
Location: Near that one big lake
Contact:

Post by gannon »

the 2nd non-overclocked processor would still be doing the same amount of work as normal though, so in places where the game lags at the normal clock rate the audio will still lag.
Gamelver
Moderator
Posts: 3352
Joined: Sun Apr 04, 2004 9:03 pm
Location: in my basement, to forever work on portables ;)

Post by Gamelver »

so the audio and video would be out of sync.....
Without games my life would have no meaning.
Well, I guess it would, but it would be a lot less fun!!!!!!!

Image
SgtBowhack
Posts: 831
Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2004 5:16 am
Location: Chicago, USA

Post by SgtBowhack »

Guys, you all seem confused about this. The audio won't lag. But it also can't be received by 2 processors at the same time at different rates either. It's gonna be synched no matter what, because the NES cartridge can't suddenly be capable of supplying double the data because it's connected to two NES systems. So the two systems will be receiving the same data at the same time, and probably confuse the hell out of the cartridge by sending the same requests twice. In short, even if the game doesn't crash, you will see NO benefits. And I have great doubts about it working at all (or at least maybe not in a beneficial way) because it'll just keep receiving data twice from the cartridge because that's what's on the bus. If you're lucky and it only reads after a request and does nothing about data sitting there, then it'll work but it won't be any faster.
The more I think about it, the more I come up with reasons why it's just not reasonable. The only way to do this is to involve a third processor that controls the data transfers to/from the cartridge and sends sound code to one processor and other code to the other (overclocked) one. This processor would have to run much faster than the other two (probably at double the speed of the faster one or more) to be of much benefit though, and buffer operations and be able to send to both CPUs separately.
MM007: The circuit to change pitch has to be simpler than what you're proposing, but I can't seem to find one :( Sorry!
Alchemist
Posts: 248
Joined: Mon Apr 04, 2005 3:48 pm

Post by Alchemist »

You're be implying that the 2 NES circuits have to interact with each other beyond the control input. They don't. Why use only one cartridge for two NES systems when you can use two? NES cartridges are cheap as hell, and anyway we're not talking a particularly practical project here. Even then the effect of the lag depends on how the game was coded, with a decent frameskip (so that it keeps metronome time but the framerate drops) or with full frame processing (so that it takes a varying amount of time to render the correct number of frames). If a working frameskip has been implemented then you will stay in sync. If not you're out of luck.

There isn't a simple cirduit to drop pitch, it requires digital processing to do it properly (ie you won't be making it in your garage). Probably your best bet will be to purchase a cheap guitar pitch shift unit with minimal effects.
bicostp
Moderator
Posts: 10491
Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2005 5:47 pm
Steam ID: bicostp
Location: Spamalot
Contact:

Post by bicostp »

jeeze, if you want the music so badly, why not burn a CD of it and change tracks when you go through levels? :?

Sure, no SFX, but what do you expect? :P
MM007
Moderator
Posts: 1175
Joined: Mon Apr 05, 2004 6:01 pm
Location: In the wilds of suburbia...

Post by MM007 »

I want the NES to run as well as possible while maintaining the sound.

Is there another way of boosting performance? IE: Can the 6502 address more RAM than is onboard in the NES (And will the cartridges let it use said RAM)?
Warranty-Voiding fun!

Image
SgtBowhack
Posts: 831
Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2004 5:16 am
Location: Chicago, USA

Post by SgtBowhack »

Alchemist: There are some issues with thinking you can get the control working too. You'd need both NES systems to have their clocks synched, and with one of them overclocked... that's not gonna happen. In short, this just will not work. Remember that NES controllers use a clock signal to decide what button it's polling.

MM007: The best way to do that is to run an NES at stock speed. :/ Since the NES doesn't have an operating system to speak of, there is no RAM management. Look at the N64- games that don't use the expansion RAM don't see any benefits from it.
cennar
Senior Member
Posts: 2939
Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2004 7:57 am
Location: yesterdays brothel, and todays vaccume store
Contact:

Post by cennar »

just over clock the CPU, the ppu and spu will manage
Image
goodie
Posts: 824
Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2004 1:02 pm

Post by goodie »

SgtBowhack wrote:Look at the N64- games that don't use the expansion RAM don't see any benefits from it.
Actually, I remember at least one non-expansion pak game that benefited from the expansion pak: Top Gear Rally. I played it without the expansion pak, and the frame rate was usually good. Except in one stage, when you go over a bridge the frame rate stutters for a moment. When I played it with the expansion pak, the frame rate remained smooth the entire time. Just thought I'd point that out. :)
mnbvcxzlkjhgfdsapoiuytrewq
gannon
Moderator
Posts: 6974
Joined: Sun Apr 04, 2004 4:48 pm
Location: Near that one big lake
Contact:

Post by gannon »

cennar wrote:just over clock the CPU, the ppu and spu will manage
yeah, but the spu (I'll assume you mean the sound processor) is built into the cpu, so you can't have a different clock rate for it and the cpu.
cennar
Senior Member
Posts: 2939
Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2004 7:57 am
Location: yesterdays brothel, and todays vaccume store
Contact:

Post by cennar »

really cool then why not do bouth cus the sound wont sink right up if its not k
Image
gannon
Moderator
Posts: 6974
Joined: Sun Apr 04, 2004 4:48 pm
Location: Near that one big lake
Contact:

Post by gannon »

Because the sound frequency goes up too.
Post Reply