My General Thoughts on the Seventh Generation Console War

Ecksem Diem · Post by **Ecksem Diem** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 9:15 pm

Hello. I've been observing the forum for a while and I figured it would be good to start things off with opinions on the most relevant thing to the world of video games at the moment (since I don't have any portables to show off yet): the current console war we've just been blessed (SEE: cursed) with. I apologize if any views similar to mine have already been expressed here; that said, I was unable to locate any in my searches.

I've heard a number of people express concern over the future of video games should the Wii win, considering its highly unorthodox (and "revolutionary") controller design, but until I had actually heard those concerns expressed, it hadn't even occurred to me that it would change gaming at all. Although some elements of the Wii controller would probably remain, and the option would probably be there for developers to design a game using the Wii controller to its full extent, I was (and still am) anticipating Nintendo to largely abandon the concept behind the Wii controller in favor of a more typical design, should it win this generation.

My reason for thinking that is because if Nintendo wins, it's going to mean that the hardware developers are going to start running to their door to design them the next sexy n-tuple core processor for their next gaming system. On top of that, they're going to be able to afford that kind of technology much moreso then they would've been in the past, considering that they're the only company this generation that's pulling in a profit on its hardware. Even though Microsoft is already heavily invested in the hardware industry and has tons of money to throw the Xbox' way, there is a cap on how much money they'll throw the Xbox' way (at least until well into the next generation, when they'll know beyond a shadow of a doubt that console gaming is going to be the leading cash cow in the near future as far as forms of entertainment go). The point to be found in that last paragraph of rambling is that I believe (and I don't think many people are arguing this) the Wii controller design was a last-ditch effort to recapture (or at least become a competitor in) the market, as Nintendo knew they couldn't compete technologically on any level with the PS3 or 360. Despite what Nintendo says, I'm almost certain that the Wii is not a new way of gaming that they look forward to for generations to come.

As for my thoughts outside the Wii's influence on the generation and its place in this console war, I start with a question: Is what happened to Microsoft last generation now happening to Sony this generation?

Last generation, though the Xbox (and the GameCube, to an extent, although that's not relevant here) was by far a superior machine when compared to the PS2, many of the multi-platform games of the generation were built to run on the PS2, and the ports weren't enhanced in any way on the Xbox (with the exception of Spawn being in Soul Calibur; damn, that was cool (and to hell with Link)!), so business was lost on those who may have been prompted to buy an Xbox because of it's exclusives (and it did have some very nice ones, though not everyone agrees with me on that opinion) if it were to have also had enhanced ports of PS2 (and GameCube) titles. One thing's for sure: no one was buying it because of the way Madden looked.

Now, this generation, even though the PS3's a superior machine, many of the titles for it that are appearing/will also be appearing on the 360 aren't enhanced in anyway (Oblivion comes to mind and the same may happen with GTA4; the 360 version of GTA4 is already looking like it may be the definitive version, having two confirmed sets of so-called "episodic content" that you can get from Xbox Live; I've heard rumors that there may be a set or two of different episodic content for the PS3 version, but I don't know them to be confirmed). That fact, and the fact that the PS3's losing exclusives like crazy (as well as entire franchises) are really making it seem (to me, at least) that the PS3's going to be a close third this generation (I say "close" and not "distant" because I think that the PS2's install base is simply too big to ignore; then again, Atari had quite the install base at one point in time). The "strongest console curse" (the most powerful console of a generation has never won that generation) aside, I'm beginning to think that not even MGS and Gran Turismo 5 (or Gran Turismo Forever, if you will) can save the PS3. Even as it concerns those two titles in particular (and I'm not too sure if anyone's even talking about GT5 being a "six hundred and sixty dollar game" anymore), well, Project Gotham Racing pisses all over the Gran Turismo series and GT fans with a 360 may very well be content with PGR (note that I'm speaking on pure speculation here); additionally, there's talk that MGS may be lost as an exclusive (although I don't forsee this happening, since the Japanese would react to this the same way they reacted to Nintendo screwing (or rather, trying to screw) Sony). Finally, as it pertains to 360 exclusives, even though I may think the series sucks, Halo 3 will be a system seller when it comes out. Conversely, the same goes for the Final Fantasy XIII games (there's two of them, I think) for the PS3, although that's a bit further off then Halo 3 and may come after a price drop of some sort for the PS3.

Well, I hope I didn't break any rules in my first post here. That being said... Your thoughts?

P. S. - Sorry if the post's a little hard to read, I got carried away with the side-notes and parentheses, as well as my own little quips.

P. P. S. - Does anyone else think that the Saints Row port (which, from what I've been reading, would more accurately be called a vastly enhanced remake) for the PS3 could potentially be a huge seller? I think THQ really figured out who their target audience for that game was when they were selling it on the 360 last summer, and I really think that they'll go after that same market again, but much more agressively. They've got a good amount of cheddar to buy commercials with now, and many of the problems that brought down the game's score in various reviews when it was released were fixed through patches (and you know that those that couldn't be fixed through patches will be fixed for the PS3 release).

teraflop122 · Post by **teraflop122** » Sat Apr 14, 2007 4:32 pm

Well... you obviously have good command of the english language going for you.

The topic you chose to comment on has been exhaustively worn down in dozens of threads during the last few weeks. Few people here will want to read through such a long post on that same topic.

Something which must be made clear, not only to you but to everyone else in the community: console makers do not care about hardware costs, they draw in the vast majority of profits from licensing fees. They earn a cut of profits from the sale of every single game for their console. I'm tired of seeing articles like "Each PS3 costs Sony 47320 dollars to make!" or "Microsoft losing XYZ dollars per Xbox sold!" It doesn't matter.

Oblivion has been graphically enhanced for the PS3, but not significantly so. You can see a side-by-side comparison in this months Game Informer, if memory serves.

Oh, and welcome to the forums, Ecksem Diem!

wallydawg · Post by **wallydawg** » Sat Apr 14, 2007 4:43 pm

I'm still stuck in the 5th generation of video games (go 3DO!). Your opinions though are well thought out and seem to be valid arguements, not just the usual OMFG PS3 ROOLZ B/C I SED SO (not from people on here, mind you, but in general).

I'll let you know my personal opinions on this generation in 10 years or so

Post by **CronoTriggerfan** » Sat Apr 14, 2007 4:55 pm

A long but interesting read. Here's how I see it. It doesn't really matter our personal opinions on the consoles, but strictly the numbers. The 360, in over a year and a half of being out, has sold about 10.5 million units; the Wii, however, in a mere 5 months, has sold over 6.5 million consoles, and that's taking into consideration that the Wii is having serious hardware shortages.

Now I'm not saying which console will "win" or not; the winner is strictly in the eyes of the beholder and the company's quarterly profits, I'm simply giving the numbers thus far. Only time will tell who comes out on top.

CTFan

Kurt_ · Post by **Kurt_** » Sat Apr 14, 2007 5:03 pm

I think you are wrong.

Nintendo has always been doing controversial things that seemed stupid at the time. Sure, the virtual-boy was a flop, but how about their decision to NOT switch to CD's, like all the "cool people" at the time. If I do recall, not only do CD's scratch like hell after a few years of generous gameplay, but the laser also dies out after a while. Whereas the N64 decided to use cartridges. No burnt-out laser, no scratched cartridges (well, scratched cartridges, but that doesn't affect readability). All the N64 needs to get going again is a small sanding of the oxidized contacts.

Have fun with replacing the lasers and de-scratching CDs.

My point? Nintendo is possibly the only company that thinks into the future. As far as I can tell, Microsoft and Sony have only upgraded hardware. They didn't even bother to design new ways of playing the games, they simply upped the graphics and processors. The Playstation controllers haven't even changed since they began making the chunky PS1.

The Wii will win the console wars, because people are tired of simply upping the graphics. Although it is nice, it is not everything. The Wii introduces a new way of PLAYING games. This leads to a new way for end-users to enjoy their entertainment.

I, for one, am thrilled that movement of more than thumbs have been added to control games, and greatly look forward to the next generation, where Sony and Microsoft try to create something better than it.

Post by **bicostp** » Sat Apr 14, 2007 5:09 pm

You mean "OMFG WII ROOLZ B/C I SED SO". ;P

Welcome, Ecksem Diem! It's good to see someone who actually cares about their writing in our midst.

I believe, in the eve of this generation and the dawn of the next generation (MarioBox, Playstation 4, Xbox 720 Ultimate Edition with Service Pack 3) the standings will look like this:

- 360
- Wii
- PS3

Why?

The 360 is the most cost effective for what you get ("bang for your buck), has a huge library of titles, and a solid online community. (Using the term "community" lightly of course.) The Wii wont' be a "second system", but will primarily sell as a Mario Box because basically the whole point in buying one is to play Mario, Zelda, and Metroid games. It's too underpowered and unorthodox to justify porting big titles to. (If a game is designed for the 360 it would need to be almost completely re-worked for the Wii's limitations.) The PS3 won't do as well because of its price and loss of exclusives. If you're scouting the market for a console, and really like ShinyGame 2008, would you buy a $300 or $600 console to play it on? Yeah, you'd probably go to the cheaper 360.

Basically, in terms of sales the 360 is this generation's PS2, the Wii is this generation's Xbox, and the PS3 is this generation's Gamecube.

Kurt_ · Post by **Kurt_** » Sat Apr 14, 2007 5:17 pm

I'm still going to get a Wii. Lack of portability or not. The titles it won't have doesn't matter, it will still have many great games.

Personally, my family usually gets 10-20 games per console. 10 games on the Wii will be plenty.

SSBB, Zelda, Metroid, Mario, and some new ones that will be specifically designed to be awesome and crazy with the control system.

vskid · Post by **vskid** » Sat Apr 14, 2007 5:51 pm

Kurt_ wrote:Personally, my family usually gets 10-20 games per console.

Its the same for me, so I don't have many crappy games and have some of the best for the given system. I fully research games before I buy to make sure they are a good deal. I usually wait for the to be a platinum hit (or similar) to get my games, because they are usually $20.

Felino · Post by **Felino** » Sat Apr 14, 2007 8:56 pm

Firstly, I know this is mainly about the console wars, but in a way gaming on the pc/mac is a lot better.

$- You can have better proformance and graphics
$- Easier to move around, ie laptops ( no comments ben )
$- And you can use a computer for other things, web, movies, etc etc, even *shudders* work!
$- You can play the games on a higher-res, higer quality screen, and chose the controller you want, mouse, joysticks, controllers, etc etc.

With the proformance section, you can upgrade the quality of the computer, and drivers, with out buying a completly new system ( ahem ps ), there are a range of free games avaliable, and you can write you own, unlike having to pay upwards of $70 for each game or you can 'aquire' games And you can use this upgraded system for other things, as outlined above. Even work! And usually the screen is of higher quality, I hate flickering CRT screens, they give me a headache.

Well, thats my 3 cents on the matter.

-Felino.

EDIT: 200th post! Woot!

Metroid fan · Post by **Metroid fan** » Sat Apr 14, 2007 9:42 pm

I think that the wii will either win or come in second place (but don't quote me on that) and even though it has no games right now some will come around later. I'm hoping for pikmin 3, and maybe some new franchise that will rock the house.

dragon · Post by **dragon** » Sun Apr 15, 2007 1:56 pm

Kurt in all fairness how can you call the play station controlor cuncky look at the xbox controlor even the s type is biger than the playstaions.

i just perfare the playstation controlor.

Post by **Gamelver** » Sun Apr 15, 2007 2:18 pm

General information that should be known (and this has been stated many times before):

More power does not just mean better graphics! It also means better physics, more realistic conditions, more complexity, and, in short, more realistic games.

Just thought I'd do some reminding

...

Kurt_ · Post by **Kurt_** » Sun Apr 15, 2007 2:38 pm

There's also too much power for the current formats and game capabilities.

And I was calling the Chunky PS1 chunky. The one that isn't not chunky. Not the controllers. And I must say the Xbox controllers pwn. The smaller ones, of course.

Post by **Gamelver** » Sun Apr 15, 2007 2:40 pm

Kurt_ wrote:There's also too much power for the current formats and game capabilities.

aren't those determined by the power of the system

?

How can there be too much power for new games

....

Post by **bicostp** » Sun Apr 15, 2007 2:57 pm

One thing I forgot to say regarding the whole "games don't have to look good to be fun" thing...

Of course they don't, but who says all the possible graphics horsepower has to be utilized on the stronger systems?

Why can't they make a simple cartoony game for the PS3 or 360? Some people sound like every game for those systems *has* to be a graphics bonanza... The capability is there, but you don't have to utilize it.