Your take on dragons.

Twisted Warthog · Post by **Twisted Warthog** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 9:10 am

What you mean in the Bible how it always talks about evil serpents and that 10 headed dragon at the ending.

Shadeslayer · Post by **Shadeslayer** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 3:59 pm

Job 41. The whole chapter talks about the leviathan. The leviathan was a massive lizard like animal that could spit fire and was the top of the food chain.

Twisted Warthog · Post by **Twisted Warthog** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 4:22 pm

The Leviathan was a giant sea serpent not a dragon. You clearly have it all wrong. In the Hebrew Language Leviathan even means whale. Look up your information before you type it down.

Limewater · Post by **Limewater** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 4:38 pm

Twisted Warthog wrote:The Leviathan was a giant sea serpent not a dragon. You clearly have it all wrong.

The creature described in the passage in question is clearly an aquatic creature, but you seem to have a pretty restrictive definition of what you'll consider to be a dragon.

And there is a somewhat strange reference to this creature expelling fire.

Apparently, if it doesn't precisely fit the description of Smaug in "The Hobbit" then it's not a dragon.

In the Hebrew Language Leviathan even means whale. Look up your information before you type it down.

Actually, it's only come to mean whale in modern Hebrew.

That is not the definition of the word as it was used in Job.

Twisted Warthog · Post by **Twisted Warthog** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 5:01 pm

Hey you know whats really annoying

When people type like this.

And try to make a dragon seem to be whatever the heck they want.

Next thing yeah know your going to say snakes evolved from dragons.

And are trying to become evil.

again.

Limewater · Post by **Limewater** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 6:05 pm

Twisted Warthog wrote:Hey you know whats really annoying

When people type like this.

Thanks. If I ever encounter someone who types like that I'll make a point to be annoyed.

And try to make a dragon seem to be whatever the heck they want.

Given the wide variance of "dragon" descriptions in Chinese, European, Middle-Eastern, and Native American lore, as well as the wide variance of "dragon" descriptions in more modern fantasy and science fiction literature, there is a large amount of leeway.

East Asian dragon lore actually has dragons living underwater most of the time and they are strongly associated with water. Native American dragons are huge serpents which are not generally held to breathe fire.

Fossil records we have of velociraptors do not correspond very well with the velociraptors depicted in the movie "Jurassic Park." They aren't like the ones in the movie, but that doesn't mean that velociraptors did not exist.

Twisted Warthog · Post by **Twisted Warthog** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 6:42 pm

Wow lecture all of us some freaking more.

Limewater · Post by **Limewater** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 7:09 pm

Twisted Warthog wrote:Wow lecture all of us some freaking more.

I'm sorry. I was under the impression that people reading a thread entitled "Your take on dragons" might be interested in reading information on dragons. Clearly I am mistaken, and the actual point of this thread is to complain that three paragraphs is too much to read.

Oh well. I will make an effort to not make such an error again.

vskid · Post by **vskid** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 7:10 pm

Twisted Warthog wrote:Wow lecture all of us some freaking more.

He is just giving he take on the topic and other comments about it. Isn't the point of a forum to type up replies and submit them? He is making a valid point, nothing wrong with that.

Twisted Warthog · Post by **Twisted Warthog** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 8:51 pm

Ok, ok. I'll try and get back on topic here. Dragons might of been a type of Dinosaur that we have not discovered yet, or they may not be. I was saying that Dragons may be in a totally different family than the known flying family of Dinosaurs like Quetzalcoatlus. Nobody knows if Dragons flied with the Dinosaurs or that they may of evolved from some flying Dinosaurs and survived the Ice Age. Which is very very slim.

Limewater · Post by **Limewater** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 10:28 pm

Twisted Warthog wrote: Dragons might of been a type of Dinosaur that we have not discovered yet, or they may not be.

There's also the possibility that dragons are a type of dinosaur that we have already discovered. Personally, I'd be willing to bet that the term was applied to several distinct species.

I was saying that Dragons may be in a totally different family than the known flying family of Dinosaurs like Quetzalcoatlus.

You use the word "may," which softens your language. Do you think that there needs to be a distinction between dragons and known American species of flying dinosaur? If so, why? They seem to be fairly consistent with Native American dragon lore.

Twisted Warthog · Post by **Twisted Warthog** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 10:37 pm

I give up.

Theirs just no reasoning with you.

Limewater · Post by **Limewater** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 11:03 pm

Twisted Warthog wrote:I give up. Theirs just no reasoning with you.

I don't understand your need for ad hominem attacks against me. I simply asked a question about why you believe what you appear to believe.

Nobody is going to look at you funny for stating that you don't believe in dragons. In terms of dragons as depicted in common western imagination, with hind legs, forelegs, and separate wings, I think that it is quite likely that a creature exactly meeting that description never existed.

I simply think that such popular descriptions are based on other, similar creatures that were at the time called dragons. Salamanders exist, but they don't exactly match earlier beliefs and descriptions about them as being born from fire.

Twisted Warthog · Post by **Twisted Warthog** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 11:05 pm

I actually believe in Dragons. Just not that they were Dinosaurs.

Limewater · Post by **Limewater** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 11:13 pm

Twisted Warthog wrote:I actually believe in Dragons. Just not that they were Dinosaurs.

Earlier you said that you want to believe in them but you find it hard to.

I'm just curious why you think that they are creatures distinct from dinosaurs. Since you claim to believe something, surely you have a reason for holding that belief. That is why I asked.

I guess in some sense I don't believe that all animals that would have been classified as dragons would today be called dinosaurs. But I do think that there is a likely a strong overlap.