Who thinks Vista will make it?

cowsgoquack101 · Post by **cowsgoquack101** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:09 am

Sparkfist is right there isn't much difference between the three main XP OS's. Home edition, media center, and professional all can do the same thing. The only real difference is that they have different programs. Media center is different in that it has a fancier slide show and can use a remote. Proffesional has all of the business esque programs. Home edition just compiles everything together and does it without using a lot of power and memory like pro. and media center do.

Website · Post by **Life of Brian** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:58 am

cowsgoquack101 wrote:Sparkfist is right there isn't much difference between the three main XP OS's. Home edition, media center, and professional all can do the same thing. The only real difference is that they have different programs. Media center is different in that it has a fancier slide show and can use a remote. Proffesional has all of the business esque programs. Home edition just compiles everything together and does it without using a lot of power and memory like pro. and media center do.

I don't understand what the complaint is. What should the different versions be? I'm not being argumentative, I'm just curious as to how you think it should be set up, and why is it that the different versions of windows is the suxors for being the way they are.

Post by **Sparkfist** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 7:28 am

If you've ever installed RedHat (and I know some of you have), it give the options for "desktop", "server", "workstation", and "custom". Now each of these has a default list of programs that are installed, however you can change that. I think if your going to make an OS you make one and let the user customize the installation.

With multiple versions all it's going to do is confuse many endusers who may think they need the top of the line home version. As I said before having multiple versions is strictly out of greed so that users upgrade or have to upgrade to use new programs on the same OS.

If you're paying over $150 for Winodws you should be able to get a full version that gives you the able to tailor it to what you want/need. This is just like Microsoft Office, where you have about 6 different versions of the same thing but have to pay as much as $500 for the full version, otherwise if you buy the base model you get a whole word processor.

All the things that Microsoft is doing, Office and Vista are being marketed to maximize income. I really laughed when I saw a version of Office (teacher edition I believe) that costed $150 and really is the same thing as OpenOffice.org.

x24 · Post by **x24** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 10:56 am

Umm.. Im in school getting an Office Vertification taking every aspect of OfficeXP2k3 before my class is done.. and I use OpenOffice2.0 at home.. OpenOffice is awesome software but it doesnt compare.. OpenOffice seems to be a bigger resource hog (that always bugs me about non-game type apps)..

The only one I use on a regular basis is Calc which is the Excel equivilant, in case people dont know. and it only has about 1/3 the possible formulas.. its macro features and forms are subpar. and tho it claims it can open, view, and edit files made in excel, its opened up .xls files and it wasnt even sure what a few basic formulas were.. some formulas are also done with new strings.. IF statements (One of the first things I learned in my classes) is completely formatted different. Something I made in class in OfficeXP02 would not work on OpenOffice2.0Beta.

The database software (base) is complete crap.. its forms are opened in write (the word equiv).. it has about 4-5 properties for the entries but Access has about 30 different features for entries in the normally many tables that make up a single database. Not that Access makes good database software either.

OpenOffice's Write program isnt bad.. Its missing a few features and moved some things into areas that are really hard to adjust to but its really good for a free word processor.

The student/teacher editions are more than affordable for what its capable of doing. my only complaint is that it doesnt come with Publisher. The price for the S/T edition is fine but it should include some sort of version of each (even at minimum features). I'm at the point where we're learning the software that doesnt come with the S/T edition and nobody has it at home because they wont upgrade it from the other..

It may have the same types of software Sparkfist but the quality is about $150 differnt

Bay_Wolf · Post by **Bay_Wolf** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 2:03 pm

My school buys the Student and Teacher edition of office and they let me take it home and install it on my computer because my teachers trust me and stuff

. Plus its my gradeschool that lets me do that im in highschool now but i still go there everyday afterschool because my dad works there.

Regards and Vista will do about as much as XP did.

Post by **bicostp** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 2:54 pm

I haven't even upgraded this machine to Service Pack 2.

My friend has the install DVDs for the latest Vista Beta (I think his dad works for M$ or beta tests for them or something). Yes, 2 DVDs for an installation. He says the computer he runs it on took 3 gigs just to install the OS, and another couple hundred megs for debugging and error reporting and that kind of thing. Apparently Microsoft scrapped the vector graphics and is sticking with raster images for the interface.

I think it's just a bigger, shinier, more demanding, less compatible rebuild of SP2.

As for me? Even though I could probably run Vista, I'll wait a while and probably stick with XP. I use a lot of older (read: windows 32 bit, win 98 compatible) programs (Flash MX, Photoshop 7, Offixe XP...) and I don't plan on upgrading everything I have just to run something brand new.

Notice how some Vista icons and widgets look like the "cryatal" icons and more for Linux, mostly KDE and Gnome?
<a href="http://img25.imageshack.us/img25/735/24 ... ">Gnome</a>
<a href="http://img97.imageshack.us/img97/802/un ... ">Vista</a>
Coincidence? I think not!

Is Vista partly a marketing scheme?

Look at it this way:
You install Vista
You try installing Office but your current version doesn't work
You go back to the store and cough up another 200 bucks to <s>Big Brother</s> Billy Gates for Office Vista
So if you buy the new OS you have to buy new software too.

Isn't there a program out there that makes XP look like Vista?

XPCportables · Post by **XPCportables** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 5:49 pm

Here is the for real deal. my new compy meets all of the system requiremants and what not blah blah blah... but really I am not going to upgrade to it unless a lot of new programs start requiring it. WinXP is just fine for me, I mean load up window blinds with a cool skin and you have windows vista. I did a school project on Vista so I know a lot about it, I know that it's hardware requirements are insane, I know that all 3 pillers of WinVista (the 3 pillers being WinFS, some new security system, and something else that I cant remember off the top of my head) have been scraped. these 3 were supposed to be the huge selling point of Vista, they were supposed to be a windows revolution. WinFS is still going to come but you will have to wait for Vista sp1 before you will get it. all in all Vista is just win xp service pack 3. I will keep XP for as long as I can.
:EDIT: bic that program would be window blinds.

mandrke · Post by **mandrke** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 12:45 am

windows vista will proberly use win32 apps as well as .net apps otherwise the coustermers will complain!
but they will probery ditch win16 i.e. win3.xx apps, Windows 95 apps are the same as win nt/2000/xp apps all win32
all versons exept one are most likely one set of disks, for both 32 and 64 bit editions!
12/16 visions? now that's too many but there is only one starter edition (the 32 bit only OS, only avalible in developing contrys)
2 main home editions (one basic-no advanced media access, the other Premium whitch is like media center and more)
3 Professional editions (standard, Small Business for business w/o IT staff incuding OneCare, and Enterprise including Microsoft Virtual PC and multiligual user interface [only avalible in Enterprise agreements not OEM or retail])
2 "N" editions (only avalidlein the EU) [home basic and Professional]
and one ultimate edition this include: (as quoted fron wikipedia)
This edition will work as a superset of the Home and Professional editions and additionally come with podcasting supportâ€”which Microsoft has renamed "blogcasting"â€”a game performance tweaker (code-named WinSAT), DVD ripping capabilities, and possibly supporting special online services for downloadable media. The Ultimate Edition is aimed to be the most impressive edition of Vista, aimed for high-end PC users, gamers, multimedia professionals, or PC enthusiasts. This version is "the best choice" for people who want the best in their Windows Vista experience.
that is only 9 non server editions but 5 avalible in the shelves for us to buy in the US/AUS etc...
but they will still have "non removeable" components like IE7 but other people, given time, could proberally hack them off. and ditching w16 or hybrid apps you could always buy VPC or VMware to run them.
And about Apple... YOU NEVER FIND MAC CLONES IN THE MACINTEL SYSTEM at least legaly, so while the mac is on the X86 or the EM64T/AMD64 system you cannot build a macintel and buy MacOs X so there

pardon the shouting
Mandrke

Post by **benheck** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 1:07 am

Yeah, this looks like what would pop out 9 months later if Linux and OS X got a room.

I have XP Pro on my big computer, XP home on my laptop. There is NO difference whatsoever. Maybe the Pro is a little more anal about security (big computer sees laptop files easier than vice versa) But if you want to connect to a domain (a la for businesses) THEN you must get Pro.

I firmly believe Microsoft (and others, the Mac has some pointlessly excessive window open/close animations itself) gussy up the graphics of the OS for the sole purpose of eating up clock cycles and thus driving processor sales. Think about it, the curved window edges in XP? That takes more memory and clock cycles to draw than a square edge. Same for the shading on the toolbar and window headers.

What does the average person do with a PC? Download music, look at photos of ugly babies, send email and surf the web. Maybe some Office stuff. You could do all that fine with a 120 MHZ Pentium and Windows 95. Or XP. XP has had a record FOUR YEARS and counting as being the main OS. (Considering how Microsoft used to release new OS's every 2 years almost) That's a lot of users, Vista won't replace them anytime soon. In fact, what if it became the next WINDOWS ME???? Dum da dummmmm!

Here's a good feature for Vista: open/save dialog boxes that PREDICT what folders you'll want to be in. Example, when doing web updates, I open a photo from my Memory stick reader in Photoshop, then goto save it. Windows brings up the Memory stick folder, why would I save it back there? So I goto my Image folder. Click click blah blah not gettin' any younger. OK it's saved.

But then I goto load another photo, and I'm in the Image folder! So I goto the Memory stick, load the photo, do whatever, go to save it - I'm in the Memory stick folder! The first time maybe, but why can't Explorer PREDICT where I might load and save from after the first time or two. This happens in all sorts of programs and is a pain in the butt - I can't be the only one who notices this.

It'd be cool if the load/save dialog box had two "working folder" buttons. 9 times out of 10 when you work with computers there's a folder you take stuff from, do things to it, then put it someplace else. The dialog box could have quick links to them! Why not?

And that sort of thing wouldn't even eat up clock cycles

Well time for sleep.

Post by **Skyone** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 3:34 am

benheckc wrote:Here's a good feature for Vista: open/save dialog boxes that PREDICT what folders you'll want to be in. Example, when doing web updates, I open a photo from my Memory stick reader in Photoshop, then goto save it. Windows brings up the Memory stick folder, why would I save it back there? So I goto my Image folder. Click click blah blah not gettin' any younger. OK it's saved.

Do you know how many perverts on family computers would be mad because of images automatically saving in 'My Images'?

Post by **Sparkfist** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 8:33 am

Mandrke, you make a few good points. But really who comes out on top when you have to go out and spend (likely) $100 to upgrade your system for something like basic video playback or basic network administrator tools? Microsoft really is raping people with this model.

And I'll admitt that yes because the whole of the PC user base only know Windows it will likely make it. Maybe not as strong as previous verstions. Windows has lost some market share in the pass few years and with Linux distros aimed at the desktop; Fedora, Debian, Gentoo and Ubuntu and so on. They'll lose more.

Look Windows 2000 wouln't have made it to the desktop if Office users hadn't wanted it. More Companies are moving to Unixies and really who is going to want to spend in excess of $600 for a new computer system for each desk in an office?

G-force · Post by **G-force** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 9:38 am

I never understood why every one in the universe latched onto XP like they did. Heck, I think any new games out there require it to play. It's nice and all, but not all that great. I mean it takes up WAY too much memory and resources just for doing nothing but sitting there! I guess it was the best of the crap so it was chosen as the new OS. So maybe thats all Vista has to do, be better than XP by only a little bit. Then it becomes the new king of the crap.
I will only buy Vista if the new PC games require it. Other than that, I'm just fine wiht my Dell (Dude!!) and XP setup.

I've never tried linux myslef, but it seems like businesses could really benefit from it. Why don't you ever see a non-XP machine in a store? Is it too hard to setup? Or maybe they are worried about security?

Apple is apple. They're good but they never seem to get enough support from 3rd party to get really flying.

mandrke · Post by **mandrke** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 1:59 am

G-force wrote:Why don't you ever see a non-XP machine in a store? Is it too hard to setup? Or maybe they are worried about security?

The answer is microsoft won't allow it. ever since the MS-IBM split (i.e. over OS/2). the software giant has said that no-one who makes a pc with windows preinstalled can sell it with another OS and most people are used to windows and won't try to come out of their confont zone and install GNU/Linux

Sparkfist wrote:who is going to want to spend in excess of $600 for a new computer system for each desk in an office

Ever head of volume licences?

Here's my 5Â¢ worth

rawls · Post by **rawls** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 9:42 am

The IT guy in my office got a beta version of Vist to test and really wasn't all that impressed. Basically it is a prettier version of XP. Sure there are enhancements, but one should probably wait till mid/late 2007 to make sure most of the inevitable security/operational flaws are ironed out. If I wanted my desktop to look prettier, I would go with crApple or a tricked out Linux box.

On the other hand, Robert Fripp is contributing to the "soundscape" of vista. If I was a little more into King Crimson, this might be a selling point.

In the meantime, I am going to upgrade to WinXP 64-bit - which just came out in a final release version - and be happy.